In before the “should have stayed with Lehner” BS.
What a horrible showing from the team. Good god that was painful.
In response to hq8 in the previous thread.
Well in hindsight, yes, Murray got fleeced big time. But at the time Bishop was a back up (the best one) and Conacher actually was in he race for Calder. Maclean has not used him properly this season, he’s all over the place
I think Murray got a good deal. I also don’t think Murray thought Conacher was going to be stud.
I think Murray figured Conacher would be helpful in the playoffs (he was) and they would re-assess Conacher this year. Conacher was a cheap and effective pickup. We normally spend our seconds (what we gave up for Bishop) on playoff rentals anyway. I still see it as great asset management by Murray.
The option at the time was Bishop for a 2nd or Bishop for conacher really
Murray stated he wanted to get at least a 2nd back, which is what we gave up for Bishop. Can’t look back at this trade with 20/20 impossible to do
Bishop is one of the best goalies in the NHL right now. Conacher, love his effort but he aint top in anything right now. Infact PMac doesnt even know where to utilize him. He may infact be dropped/not re-signed soon enough. So that would mean we lost Bishop for nothing…
Yeah Chirp and Tooks I’d like to hear your thoughts, but do you smell a goalie controversy (especially if Lehner starts and plays well against Boston)?
Well since PMac is in the line juggling business maybe he should try this to jump start the Sens.
TO EDM: Cowen +
TO OTT: Yakupov
Mac Turris Ryan
Yak Spezza Zib
This is dramatic I know, but I believe that Zib and Yak would work great together, both very different styles with Spezza playing the playmaker.
Hard to say if PMac would utilize Yak to his strenghts but he cant do no worse than Eakins. The panel seems flabbergasted by how Eakins uses Yak. Last year under Krueger 17 goals in 46 games. This year 2 in 13?14?…
I know we need D, but that can be done in house. Keep Boro up, Cowen’s spot can be filled by Ceci or Claesson, they cant possibly do any worse.
So out of 8 defensemen, have 4 (essentially 5 with Gryba) as rookies?
Gryba wouldnt play much, but yeah, Ceci and Claesson if we need him. So only 1 rookie in the top 4, not bad, Boro is a great 5/6 and Phillips or Gryba can be the 6/7.
Pair Methot up with Ceci to handle defensive breakdowns and PW46 and Karlsson should do just fine. If Ceci becomes the Doughty’esq type player he is projected to be, then PW46 comes back down with Methot.
I think PW46 is a great 3/4.
Weircioach with Karlsson? Good god no. We have enough troubles on D as it is.
It cant get any worse. Ok so try Claesson up with Karlsson, they both know each other and played together in the SEL.
I think its more the slow moving D are trying to over play their game. They are trying to skate the puck out instead of passing it up to the forwards. If your Phillips, Cowen, and Gryba the point should be to pass it off to either your defense partner or up to the forwards (Not up the Middle), not skate it out like your Karlsson. And the coaching staff needs to pound this into them. They need to simplify everything, back check, get the puck out of the zone and into the offensive zone. And then a couple passes and put the puck on net!! Shoot more!!
Yakupov at least would put some asses in the seats for awhile anyways! I would do it – would the oilers?
Well thats what I dont know? Not sure what the Oilers stance on Cowen is, they did like him last year didnt they? Not sure how much they value him now. Cowen + IMO would be enough to bring in Yak (we can say the same thing they are, not playing up to par, struggling, bla bla bla…)
I can’t believe anyone would still want Yakopov considering what is going on in Edmonton right now. He is crying to his agent to talk to management about getting more ice time, he should talk to JOB in Bingo to see how well that went for him here in Ottawa. Besides that he is a flight risk if he doesn’t get his way, I don’t want to see any more Russian players in Ottawa, especially young ones who will always use the KHL as leverage to extort what they can from their team. Cripes, he isn’t even a good player, he is selfish, plays an individual game not a team game, is small, soft & isn’t scoring in the NHL. He probably belongs in the AHL which is where I would have sent him by now. Cry baby.
Yak is still very much a kid, and the jury is out as to what he will develop into. Yes, be cautious about the Russians and the KHL threat, but he still is a quality prospect.
Cowen is still a kid too and he’s still developing himself. Yes, it’s true that he doesn’t have the speed, etc., but he’s not the reason we’re not winning. We have to weather this out — the eastern teams do not have what it takes (right now) other than maybe Boston & Pitts. Ottawa is still a couple of years out of serious contention. Keep calm and carry on!
Gonna assume that the comment section today and twitter will be filled with panic. Fact is they only played a little worse than they did on Saturday so not much has changed really. Even in the three wins the team was still far from where it needs to be.
Just need to get back moving in the right direction. Hopefully Murray doesn’t make any impulsive moves here. Not against a trade or even a couple of trades – as long as they’d make sense if we had won last night.
Hax do you really think its gonna be ok if we just keep playing .500 hockey? Things dont look to be getting any better, even our wins, if not for Lehner, we lose all 3.
If cowen starts playing like the monster that he is. And karlsson stops being a hot dog, we will be much improved and the games wont be decided by our goaltender
I just dont know if either of those things will happen this season
Ya lots of IF’s, I think its time to dump Cowen before other teams realize he aint that good. I dont even know if he has value at this time, probably not, his mistakes are glaring. Maybe a team would take a chance on him cuz he’s young? Injuries and all.
Long term cowen will be great. Its not a question of if, but when…
His contract is very tradeable. I would guess that he has good value.
Just wish the team developed him in the ahl for 2 seasons before bringing him up
To be honest, what have you seenf rom him in 1 full year and last year playoffs and this year that makes you believe he will be great?
This isn’t an over-reaction rather an honest question. We keep saying when he develops, but last year returning from injury he was brutal in the playoffs. If it wasn’t for his fight in game 3 we wouldn’t have noticed him, and he was god awful vs Pittsburgh
He got sheltered minutes the year before with Karlsson winning the Norris and team’s focussing on him
I want him to succeed, but he is showing no signs or any promise. He is quickly turning into Tyler Myers
What have I seen? Not much.
What d I know? He was rushed into the league way before he was ready. His development curve is suffering. Hes in a sophomore slump. He has talent
Keep in mind he also missed most of his draft year due to injury
Up to now his whole career has been centered around this “potential” Time to toss that word aside and time for him to live up to expectations
Yep injuries, knee surgery and hip surgery. 2 very crucial parts of a hockey body, especially for Cowen’s style of play and as a D. I believe his hip injury has done him the most damage, he just hasnt been as mobile, seems super stiff and hesitant.
Tyler Myers says hello
Awesome comparison, couldnt agree more!
IMO he wont be “great” he can be good, but not great. He’s a slow moving D with hardly an offensive touch. I guess Hal Gil was decent, until his older days.
Off topic question -
Has anyone been in the Coke Zero section at CTC this year? In previous years this was an alcohol free zone, but I don’t see any mention of these sections being alcohol free this year. Does anyone know if alcohol is now permitted here?
I thought I heard that alcohol was now allowed in those sections. Does anybody know for sure?
Yes it is
Lowlights, you mean.
No, no. That’s not what they’re called.
Explain the logic behind that conclusion.
Well they highlight how bad the Sens were, so it ain’t wrong.
Things that maclean says that piss me off:
1. He has a history of playing 70 games. So we’re going to play him 70 games
2. Spezza and michalek have played together a lot. So we’re going to try to keep that chemistry
3. The best players play
4. Zack smith is our best player
5. Turris and MacArthur are inseparable so We’ll play neil on the first line
6. A left handed defenceman needs to be paired with a right handed defenceman
7. We’re not playing bad… we just haven’t found our identity yet
Yeah I know that line is playing great, hard to break them up but at some point he will be forced to do so.
If we keep losing I could see:
Hoffman Turris Ryan
Mac Spezza Zib
Or put Conacher in place of Hoffman for one last chance
1. In 13 seasons anderson has only played 70 games twice (playoffs included)
2. They have no chemistry. Never have. Never will
3. Benches lehner. Zibby to 4th line. Prince to bingo. Pageau owns training camp then gets tryout playing with kassian.
4. Omg. Things are worse than I thought
5. How do you know spezza wont have better chemistry with mac than turris does? Did you even try?
6. Stupidity. Plain and simple
7. Its the coaches job to create the identity. Not the players
Although I do agree on some points, the guy knows more than all of us combined. Jack Adams nominee in his first year, won it on his second. I trust ‘Stache and Murray.
It is painful to watch, but the boys aren’t doing what they should. It’s not on the coach at this point.
Lots of coaches win the Jack Adams, dont mean shit. Look at Ted Nolan, Bob Francis, Torts, Boudreau, Vigneault, Ruff…The list goes on… they all got sacked.
Maclean didnt have the superstars to coach, he had a bunch of AHL players playing for contracts and a shot at the bigs. The players obviously overachieved and I think Maclean would be the first to admit this. Also Anderson and Lehner probably had the most impact on his Jack Adams. Thats has nothing to do with coaching.
You’re kidding, right? So much wrong. Not even going to touch this one…
What is he wrong about?
With Spezza and Karlsson out the team used a bunch of young players and they had a buzzsaw game plan, we were very tight defensively and everyone was “all in”. Now the team is giving up more chances because Spezza and Karlsson are creative and giving up a ton against (Spezza’s line gives th emost 5 v 5 chances against on the whole team).
Anderson was playing all-world as well, partly because of the shortened schedule and partly because of the lockout, players weren’t all up to part and in game shape, making shooting stats vary wildly.
THIS year there are expectations and MacLean looks totally lost.
Keep talking amongst yourselves (see what I did there?).
Driving into work today, having to hear the Sens #FEARLESS advertisements, I had to use my fullest restrain not to punch the stereo.
What is most depressing about how this season is going so far, is largely due to my/our increased expectations. Karlsson is coming around, Ryan and Lehner have been awesome, a lot of others that have big expectations tied to them are shitting the bed. Cowen is a good example and some of our vets have really lost a step, Phillips and Neil are great examples… Anderson is struggling… our D seems far weaker that I ever envisioned anyways….
The only good out of last night was the “excuse” that Philly played a really strong game. I don’t know what bug finally got up their assess but they really did come out flying and never stepped off our throats.
I just don’t get it, this is a far cry from the same team I watched last year. Its like they are playing individual instead of as a team. And either they aren’t responding to PM or he isn’t sending the message he needs to. Greening needs to sit a game. Cowen needs to sit a game. Kassian is becoming less useful for the 4 min he plays.
The Defense attempts too much coming out of their zone and chases the puck in their zone. Teams are not afraid of them. They seem to panic as soon as the opposing team starts a cycle.
The Senators Forecheck is almost no existent. Michalek is invisible and doesn’t use his speed to get on the defense.
Its very frustrating to watch and if the Senators maintain this level of play, expect something to give.
Excellent post, not a rant, it is exactly what is wrong with this team
Ceci was supposedly the most ready D in his draft year. In the Highlights from Bingo he looks great! C’mon call him up – we need another D who can skate the f-ing puck out of the Zone. DaCosta and Hoffman on any other team would be in the big leagues but No we like to play two nowhere lines in the bottom 6. The third line has to be offensive. We have the perfect 4th line Smith-Neil-Condra(greening bench him – he’s terrible- no clue on the ice).
Hoffman-DaCosta or Pageau-Zibby c’
mon lets go. Also,Conacher can join Greening upstairs for awhile till Murray pulls the trigger. Cowen upstairs as well
Oh yeah cuz Corvo not impressed.
Yep I agree with everything, except I don’t think Corvo has been that bad not getting that many games… I would bring all three up you mentioned and Pageau too. Hell – where Jimmy at?
Ya Corvo hasnt been all that bad for the time he played, he’s actually been decent. Well better than Cowen, Phillips, Gryba…
Corvo has been okay in a very limited role. I’m easier on Phillips because he continues to get assignments that are way beyond his abilities at his age. And, that’s mostly due to the shortcomings of Cowen and Weircioch (as a 2nd pairing). I feel bad for the old man. Phillips should be taking on a mentoring role and only playing in the 5/6 pairing at this point in his career.
Not that I am for it or against it, I’ll leave that up to the Sens management, but Cowen is an ideal player for the Oilers given his long term deal, age and $3M cap hit.
Like I tried to say before though, all of our struggling players… relative low value right now. Cowen, Michalek even Anderson.. mind you there are Oilers players in the same boat. Change of scenery trade?
On the bright side, Murray often makes strong and early moves to solidify the roster, so if we want/need to do something, he is capable of making it happen…
Oh and to add to the Grief Pile(tm) just because it is that sorta morning, I really get bad vibes about Spezz and this new role for him… he seems to be sucking it up but he can’t be too happy. We’ll see if he wants to resign here if things keep going this way for the team + his role.
Needs wingers. Badly.
Agree. Spezza desperately needs some wingers to finish his plays.
Bullshit excuse, I mean we gave him greening and neil. If he can’t use them then he can’t use anybody!!!!
Fukin right Alcatraz!
and who can forget such other studs such as:
and we have some people on here still blaming Spezza, even though he has played with all these pieces of crap!!!
Holy shit is it any doubt the poor guy is frustrated!
For the love of god please give him one NHL bonofide top 12 guy never mind top 6!
Enought of this shit of one first line and 3 forth lines, give him someone who can help him be, exactly what he is, which is a ppg player who can provide offence!
Ok simple then. You could almost say “simple plan”. Let’s put all this talk to rest about pending moves in Florida and Edmonton, swoop in there and take a forward from the Oil and a D-Man from the Panthers. I’m thinking Yakupov to play with Spezz as suggested and Campbell for D.
Anderson and Michalek would make the salary similar going both ways, what else do we need to add to the mix? Greening + Cowen?
Obviously true. He’s got very little to play with right now. But, i’m not actually convinced it’s that simple. Spezza had Ryan early on and that didn’t really help him. He’s struggling at times all on his own. Maybe he’s feeling the weight of being captain. Hopefully, something starts to click. I wouldn’t be surprised to see MacArthur/Turris/Ryan broken up next game to balance out the top two lines a little bit. I can’t believe i’m saying that because that line has been so good. But, we can’t keep going with only 1 line working.
Agree, go with duo’s:
I mentioned this before, at least Alfie had Turris on his line but kept on having to mentor the other wing. I think this played a role in his decision to just play hockey with older player and his countrymen. We need better support for Spezza before he gets more then frustrated. This could have a trickle effect on signing Ryan. I really hope not. Just my 2 cents. GSG
I wonder if Luke Schenn could help the sens. He has been healthy scratched a few times by the flyers so his value should be low. Not sure what the asking price would be though.
Wow, some crazy back and forth debates about the entire team. Yes, the Sens lost to Philly 5 to 0. I was somewhat right when I said Philly will no doubt have the best game of the year against the Sens, because that seems to be the norm for this team. We tend to help struggling teams get over humps and start on the right track. I’m sure it happens to more teams, but as we focus on the Sens it’s more apparent.
I’m not in the mix saying we should trade, not because of that game. If we are going to trade, it’s something the Sens should do for a long term plan, not a quick fix. We don’t have problems scoring, so I can’t see any issues there. And lost night was a complete team failure, that happens to every team no and again.
We have problems with our Defense playing D right now. Those turnovers are KILLER. And yes people, they happened all of last year too, it’s just our Goalies who kept us from seeing the more often result, Goals in the back of the net. I love our D, but there are some shortcomings that need to be fixed. If Ottawa makes a trade, I’m sure it’ll be for solid Defensive D, in the top 4 variety.
As for Andy, he came back and didn’t have a good game. He’s had some trouble this season for sure, especially those wrap arounds. Two last night, he had one or two of them in other games this season. I assume the reduced net size has been an issue for him, or it’s opened a glaring hole in his game all together. Either way, I can see teams testing that out on the Sens more often. I said yesterday that Andy would play Philly and Lehner would get Boston and I think we’ll see that happen after last night.
I’m bummed but pretty level headed today actually. It wasn’t the game last night that is the problem, it is the game last night was icing on the cake. We’ve been waiting all season for this team to turn the corner, gel, jive, mesh, find an identity, whatever pet name you want to give it. But reality is, other than an emotional, convincing, rapid paced effort against Detroit…. this team has been languishing in *something* all year and the longer 9it goes on the longer I feel there is something in that dressing room maybe that we don’t know about…
So yeah it is not just getting spanked by the dirty, floundering Flyers, it is ~90% of the play so far this year that leaves me wanting. A lot.
You are right though, most apparent need currently is on D.
NJ is another good trading partner, as they keep struggling, they will want to offload some vets. Mark Fayne or Andy Greene.
completely agree with Rush here
Trade idea: Michalek, Greening & Wiercioch ($8.05 mil) for Fleischmann, Matthais & Gilbert ($7.05 mil)
Tom Gilbert was a PTO. You don’t give up Weiricoch for him. Matthias is good but not worth the decrease on Defense
Reghier out in Buffalo. Lets play, lets make a trade!
Anderson + Cowen for Ehroff + Enroth + Foligno
Here is my take. I trust Paul MacLean and his decisions, however, the Ottawa Senators have 3 kitchens (current Sens roster, B-Sens roster, trade) to take stock from to make the best product.
Right now, PM is taking the same ingredients and simply trying them in different combinations, creating the same result. We are re-branding the same team over and over. Similar to a product in store with a new label. It is the same product, just a different look. That is what we have right now. New labels being stuck on each and every night.
So, 3 kitchens. Kitchen 1 – we continue to use our main ingredients and mix and match, re-label to our hearts content to cover the awful product. This is what we are doing and it is not getting us anywhere fast.
Kitchen 2. My vote, as I don’t believe we are in full panic – yet. We should bench some guys up here and bring up some guys from the B-Sens. Pageau, Hoffman, Ceci etc.. Let’s take our product, keep the ingredients we know work, but change the flavour with some new guys in the system. No new label required. Rather, same product, great new taste!
Kitchen 3. Another option to which I don’t believe we are quite ready for. However, we do have a lot of talent which simply isn’t producing or playing to their capabilities. We could do a change of scenery trade. Reach out to clubs who also have underachievers and swap. The questions that come into play here are, How much to pay/receive? And short/long term? We are in year 3 of the rebuild and hate to trade.
Will be interesting to see how the team cooks up for the next game.
Next week on Hell’s Kitchen…
You’ve been watching Junior Master Chef havent you!!!
I absolutely love your thinking!
Macarthur- Spezza- Ryan
Michalek- Turris- Conacher
Its so simple even a newfie could figure it out
PMac is from Nova Scotia – haha
Lol! Potato potaughto
So, kill the only consistent line on the team? And I’m not only talking about points, they usually dominate the opposition.
Ya and what is it doing, we’re still terrible, break it up and spread it out.
Break the only good thing we have in order to try make something else good? Great logic there champ.
We would be even worse if it wasn’t for that line.
Are we able to send Cowen down to the Bingo? Some time down under worked well for Zibby…
He just signed his second contract…. hence the holdout in training camp.
I think a trade is required and some guys brought up. They are bungling this rebuild. We re-signed some middling talent to contracts when we had equivalent guys in the system. You have to save money on these guys to be able to spend on your upper echelon guys. Why sign Greening when Dziurzynski is just as good(an example here).
You end up clugging up the system and your guys coming up get discouraged and their progression recedes! Hell Condra, Ok nice guy but he’s a dime a dozen tell me we don’t have guys in Bingo who can do his job (ahhh maybe Grant??).
@Citizenkwarren Forward lines appear to be the same as Tuesday’s game….with Condra now getting into reps on fourth line…
*bangs head on desk*
what is the definiton of insanity?
doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result!
is he going crazy or is his stoborness bording on stupidity?
Love PM but he has me worried
This was such a perfect time to shuffle the deck completely. Nobody
played well in that game. Great chance to try something different.
But we also have been preaching, patience with the lines to form chemistry. Can’t really have both?
Ya but only one line has been consistent anyway. Put Zibanejad with Spezza and leave him there.
I agree, I have said in the past that Zib is not a top 6 player, I would gladly eat crow to see him play with Spezza for a couple games, more than 2.
I think highly of Stache as a coach, as do we all. So I don’t think he is being stupid or stubborn, I think either he will prove us wrong or there at factors at play that we are not aware of… paranoia?
That’s what I think. He knows what’s going on inside the locker room, we don’t.
Hopefully it all works out.
Don’t get me wrong, as I too think highly of PM, but we have to admit that he seems to get the best out of the blue collar guys, and tends to give them the most leniency for mistakes, and has trouble working with the starts.
Greening, Neil, Phillips, Cowen can make mistake after mistake and still get rewarded with minutes. But if Zibby makes a mistake, off to the forth line he goes.
And last year was further proof that without our top stars, EK, Spezz, Anderson, and at times MM9 this team was playing better.
PM must find a way to get more out of his top guys or we will be in for a very long year
He can only work with what he has…
I can’t believe that the bad play (overall) by the defense this season has to do with the loss of Gonchar. Can it?
It sounds unpossible right? Healthy-ish EK65… Cowen with another year (and contract) under his belt… the old-again-new-again guy Corvo hasn’t been awful… it’s tough to explain.
Terrible play by a team that can’t afford to take a night off. Did they think Philly was just going to roll over?
The Sens have basically one forward line that is scoring. Somehow, someway they need to get wingers for Spezza.
Try Ryan & MacArthur with Spezza. Put Michalek & Conacher with Turris.. Turris & Michalek have had chemistry in the past.
Last season with the stars injured and the young guys came up.. they played a simple.. basic game. No fancy stuff.. no dekes — nothing. Just up and down the ice working their asses off. That’s what’s missing. Basic, basic hockey.
Heard lots of trash on Spezza… Can’t believe that. He isn’t the only player that is not playing to his capability..
Heard an interesting stat on the radio this morning. In the history of the NHL only 53 players had a point a game average throughout their careers. Six of those are in the NHL right now. Selanne, Jagr, Ovechkin, Crosby, Malkin AND SPEZZA..
This all comes down to the Owner. He will not spend money on this team.
Why the hell when Condra went down… did they not go to Bingo for help instead of putting a waste of space in the lineup — Kassian. Why? Because the team is over budget. Melnyk doesn’t want to spend any more money.
Get used to this guys.. This Owner won’t spend. So when teams in the division get better by bringing in better players as the cap goes up.. this team will remain the same.
Fans will drive Spezza out of town after next season and Ryan will follow. Why the hell would these 2 elite players play for an Owner not committed to put the best players on the ice he can.. Melnyk won’t (can’t) give them big raises.. why would they stay?
Other teams in the NHL lose more money than the Sens.. but their owners commit to spend more money on their teams.. Why? Because they have their wealth outside of hockey. Melnyk no longer has the financial resources outside of the Sens to properly own a team.. Time to sell. Get an owner in here that is committed to do the best he can to get this team to win.
They could have had freakin’ Mason Raymond for about 1M dollars.. but — over budget couldn’t. Wouldn’t offer Alfie 5.5M to start the negotiations that would most likely have kept him in Ottawa…
Waant some cheese with that wine? Get over it, for chrissake.
Get over what? Their bad play? That was pretty disgusting…
There lack of quality top 6 forwards?
An owner who won’t or can’t spend on his team.. while other teams in the division get better?
You don’t think any player from Bingo would be better in the lineup than Kassian?
BTW — I do like wine..
I disagree… It wasn’t Melnyk’s fault we lost last night…
Spezza is not an easy player to play with… Not easy to find him linemates… We need an Alfie to play with Spezza and clean up his defensive mess…
To Spezza’s credit the last few games, he’s been trying on defense… I’ve noticed his efforts…
Any trade will have to be dollars out for dollars in. Melnyk won’t spend any more than he is now.
This team needs faster players.. Michalek has been terrible this year. He should be the guy to go.. (earning 6M this season) but who will take him?
I would be willing to do Michalek for Vermette.. But not sure Phoenix would do that.
Vermette is a centre who can play wing. Very good penalty killer.. and most important.. HAS SPEED… He’s not going to get you 35 goals.. but anything would help now..
Sandy I hear your frustration and as a ticket buying fan you have every reason to be pissed after last nights game, but we keep hearing that if it makes sense, and will help the team improve EM will go over budget, but I am not certain that there is anything out there for BM to do. Given our situation with MM9 and other underperforming players, we will get hosed on any deal right now.
I would agree that it is about time some sit for a few games, and we see what a Hoffman, or a Prince or a Peterson can do in our top six, while Greening sits for a few games
Well that was another stinker to watch, I didn’t think it was all Anderson’s fault but he didn’t play all that well either except for a couple of great saves especially in the first period. The whole team once again & we have seen this several times this yr & many times in the past came out flat with no energy & couldn’t seem to do anything right. Some will say they are not getting the bounces & they could be right but IMO it takes hard work on every shift by every player to make your own luck & these guys just seem to be going through the motions. Time for a shakeup of some sort.
Ridiculous to say that PM has not used Conacher properly, he was on Spezza’s line all night last night. What would you do differently? The fact is, Conacher was brought in to score & he is not, they have tried him with everyone with the same results. IMO it’s time to sit him out & give Hoffman his shot.
Beer is allowed in every section now, as it allows one to be numb while watching this horrible on ice product. So drink up everyone!
You know this for real?
Ha. I would be a little excited.
They need the alcohol sales $$$
Not to go off on a tangent here, but it occurred to me that the struggles we are having reek of a lack of team leadership… a.k.a. the Alfie hangover.
Not saying we don’t have any leadership with the guys we have, nor am I saying that we can’t get past this… but in the past (like last year) we had a guy (Alfie) who could help lead this team out of a funk and be a beacon of good work ethic for others to follow behind.
Now, without Alfie, the new leaders (Spezza & co.) need to learn from the current struggles how to lead a team out of this. They aren’t Alfie and they can’t be Alfie, but they do need to grow into whatever leaders they need to be to move this team forward.
This type of strife might be exactly situation this team needs to force its leaders to grow into the space left by Alfie.
While I’ve been generally disappointed with the outcomes so far this season, I believe the Sens will get better as the season progresses and hopefully we can mimic LA from a few years back by sneaking into the playoffs and making some big noise.
The Alfie factor could definitely be one of the issues.
Since these youngs guys came to play about 2 seasons ago.. they have never been this bad — or struggling this much in their own zone.
The last 2 seasons nothing was expected of this team… so they could just play.
With the success last season… more is expected of this team this season…
Are some of those young guys feeling too much pressure to succeed… rather than.. just go out and play?
Chirp! Any updates? Is Maclean STILL at center ice with Zibby?
I’m on board with the hole “Team needs a shakeup” But lets be real… We don’t have the ability to make a shakeup in the trade market least not something in our favor.
I believe it needs to be done from within.
It doesn’t have to be a permanent set of call ups but Hoffman & Ceci are tops on my list. The usual Stone Peumpel Pageau what harm can it do ?
People like Cowen & Greening need to sit in the pressbox for a few.. It’s sad the contract disputes with Cowen really soured my love for him.
Zibanejad since he has come back I have not seen enough wrong with him to justify a line with Kassian – Grant – Zibanejad makes no sense.. Spezza & Zibby need to given a shot for more then 2 shifts of a game. Or at the least Michalek – Smith – Zibanejad least gives us a 3rd line that can play fast and hard.
We had 1 bad loss with a goalie who was clearly rusty! Come on fans, sad display of support after every loss in here. You’d think people would change and stop expecting 82-0 seasons!
That loss was the tip of the iceberg for most fans. Our 3 game win streak while nice was still done on iffy teams
Days like these that make me embarrassed to be a Sens fan. One ugly loss and you’re calling for Pmac’s head… Until this fanbase learns loyalty and dedication, we’re just gonna be an afterthought. Yes the Leafs and Habs suck, but they have one thing we dont have: dedication, passion, and a fanbase willing to drive those franchises WIN or LOSE. You think MLSE became a billion dollar franchise by chance? It was games like last night where you really saw the empty seats… that folks, is why we’re a budget, small market team.
It’s like listening to those out-spoken voters… who in reality never got out to vote, but are more than willing to share their opinion on the leaders in office.
not fair… this team has many loyal and caring fans, who have proven their loyalty by buying their seats to many of the games. And most of the people who come on here are exaclty those fans who have earned the right to show their unhappiness, after shelling out hundreds of dollars, and upt to 4 hours of theri time, to watch a half assed effort by millionaires. I am proud that this fan base is not as stupid as the laffs fan base. And as for the habs fans… are you kidding me? They boo their team after a one game home losing streak.
Agreed that some may let their passion get the best of them, and their rant is a little offside, but at least they care
Yeah, they care with a * … they care if you are winning now, everyone wants a championship now, a trade now, etc. Yet no one except the GM and owner, sees the big picture. I haven’t read a single logical answer or response from fans on how to “fix” the organization… earth to Sens fan, how do you fix an organization that is still GROWING? By getting rid of the one person (Eugene) that built it?! Every fan seems to say “BUDGET ONLY $50 MILL? OK RAISE TO 70!” “Cant raise? BOOOO EUGENE SUCKS!” “No raise? ALL EUGENES FAULT, HE BUSINESS MAN, HE SHOULD KNOW HOW TO RAISE EXTRA $20 MIL”
not completely sure I understand the point, however is it no what being a fan all about wanting to win a championship? And if expectations were high after a playoff year where we were missing our best players, and a first round win, why would any devoted fan not be upset at the way we have started the year?
No I am not saying fire the coach, or GM or that drastic, but this team is clearly underperforming, and it does not seem to be getting better, so yes if you dished out a couple hundred to sit through that shit last night, you are Mother Teresa if you are not upset
I agree Miguel. We wouldn’t be bitching if we didn’t give a Rat’s Ass.
Try thousands of dollars.. I’ll still go to games.. I don’t like it when they lose.. and no team wins every game…
But after that disaster last night… it is my right as a STH to be pissed off…
Take for instance, a family of four.. who pay the equivalent of about a month’s worth of groceries to go to a game or two a year.
To spend their hard earned money on watching their team play so badly.. could make them decide to spend their money elsewhere.
Coach shouldn’t be fired , there’s just a bad mix on this team and Murray has to address it.
More fans will come if the team wins. MTL and TOR have great marketing, they have been around forever, we havent, we need a winning club to attract fans and grow our fanbase, MTL and TOR have had 100 years to build a fanbase. I dont want to wait 100 years. Find ways to win now or fans will jump ship. We have the “best” coach and a great GM according to our fans and we also have great players…so why arent we winning games…
@835a6575f4bf1765fac88083fa276e93:disqus @24514923c8d9f3e60ad9487486bb8ff5:disqus You guys are sort of overreacting to overreacting. This isn’t about one game, we are all bummed the team has been in an extended funk for pretty much the entire season… People just want it to get better and it’s becoming pretty evident that some sort of “difference” will likely be required. Strategy, lines, tinkering with the roster, call-ups… *shrugs*
3 straight wins prior to last night, averaging a point per game in the standings, and mostly battling for a playoff position. Unless you bought the bs about the Sens being the favourites for the cup like the media was trying to sell you should not be THIS disappointed. Still a young team, with lots of growth to come!
The difference that is required is figuring out those bottom 2 pairings on D in terms of who works well with who, but it takes time, patience is just lacking in this fan base. It’s like we see toronto and montreal fans get irrationally negative about their teams and we decide to do the same. Strive to be better fans than those sad groups!
Its about them looking bad in every game and not being competitive. They’re being outshot by a lot in every game. If it wasn’t few great goaltending performances we’re right there with BUFFALO. There’s a serious Malaise on this team.
that too rosey of a view.
negates completely the fact that everything that was supposed to be a strength for the sens is now a weakness. top areas which were perceived strengths are now big time weaknesses: defense and bottom 6. add to that andy slumping clearly and definitively. the bishop trade is obviously a bust – conacher is not gelling with any line – not providing any of the production he showed in tampa. looking at Bishop’s record right now, it still puzzles me that Murray wasnt able to fleece someone on this – further, conacher had zero impact in the playoffs too – except for some timely goalie interference penalties.
also completely negates the most alarming fact: this team which has made the playoffs the last two seasons and has been respectable at it, cannot even break out of its zone cleanly anymore. to the point where Maclean is now having to preach clean breakouts.
negates the fact, that twice now, at CTC, slumping teams have come and shut the sens down.
also negates the fact that the sens have lost points by giving up two goal leads more than twice now.
yes, its positive that the sens have a 0.5 record in-spite of that, but lets not forget how those wins have come and the underlying factors.
i think the negatives right now far outweigh the positives of this team, and hence the record – tied for 9th with teams that are now getting arguably better. right now – and lets be honest about this – if something major doesnt change on the defensive side of things (and that means anything from level of play to personnel) this team will not make the playoffs. their level of play is nowhere close to what the teams ahead of them and around them are putting out there.
In the end all that will matter will be that they go into the playoffs hot and build on what they did last year!
Too much negative overreaction way too early in the season. We knew our D would be a ? to some extent and would need to grow throughout this season. With players coming back from injury they need time to get back up to their norm and then grow forward from there.
You need to wake up bro. The team has been playng badly, all season, except for 1 game vs Detroit. This team is not supposed to be where it is, considering the players and stars we have on it. The way we played last year, considering our stars didnt even play, you would think the trend would continue into this season. Completely the opposite, we lack passion, urgency, we are not Pesky. We had an identity last year, it just walked up and went away?
If your content with below avg hockey to a tad over .500, then thats you but that is pretty sad for a fan to be happy with.
infact, the detroit game now looks really flukey in the big picture. it looks like it had more to do with the wings tanking that day.
I agree Tooks.
En bon français : Tsé!!
The hell can one be satisfied with where we are and the play so far this season…I mean thank god for ONE good line, ONE good pairing and somewhat good duo of G’s…otherwise, we’d be looking up to BUF of FLA in the standings
Sorry man, but you seem to be the minority here. Patience and growing? We are 500% healthier, one year more experienced and a +Ryan compared to last year, and we’ve been sucking.
You miss the point, the pairings are new this year, it takes a good portion of the season to find the right ones and the right chemistry. I’m not saying wait 2 more years, I’m saying be more patient this year.
But hey, you can bitch and whine all you want, girls gotta do what a girls gotta do!
I wonder just how good the TURRIS line would be if they didn’t have to take so many defensive zone draws to make up for the short comings of others on the team??? I guess 200ft players are truly hard to come by.
For every Paulrus and Jacque Martin we ship out, there are a dozen Cloustons, Hartsburgs, Ron Wilsons, MacTavishs, waiting in the wings to completely puck up and stall the team. And how I do vividly remember the chorus of praises singing Clouston would be our saviour, a rival to Dan Bysmal. *face palm*
Serious question; did fans honestly think this team would win a Cup before any stretches of adversity at all? And at the first sign of it everyone must go? It is ridiculous. The reality is we are depending on young, inexperienced players to play key roles. It is a tough ask for any defenseman with fewer than 140 pro games experience. We have 3 that we expect to be in a top 6 of a contending team., 4 if you count borocop/gryba in the top 8. I dont think that is fair on the players. Fans might expect more but it isnt realistic. No one knows how a defenseman will turn out after 140 pro games. Giving up on these guys now is still way way too early, I dont care if they lost 20 games in a row.
So you would have expected us to be a worse team than we were last year?
Even with the addition of Spezza, Karlsson, and Anderson?
C’mon this team is underachieving, and most of us are fine with losses, but 5-0 to one of the leagues worst teams so far this year AT HOME, is not an acceptale performance, especially if you were one of the ones at this game, it was not entertaining in the least. And I did not expect us to win the cup this year, but I do expect to be able to compete vs the flyers.
It is unacceptable, not arguing that. And yes, I did expect them to be better than they have been so far. But, given all the previous success and the fact that we have better players than before; should we trade everyone and fire the coach after 18 games like many are implying? No, of course not.
Chirp – Yost has a nice small write-up today showing off some data, and the differences in play between this season and last season. He is using shot data, which he equates as a good metric of possession. I thought it sort of followed nicely based on the conversation about corsi yesterday. If you have a few seconds, take a look. The difference between this season and last season are rather startling. In this case, the shot stats are matching the sad story we’re witnessing with this team (i.e. spending too much time chasing the puck in the defensive zone). The write-up shows how this stat can give you some useful information. It also draws attention to the problems with the sens this year (so far).
To those that want everyone fired and traded; If your solution is to give up and start over with new coaches and players after every 20 game stretch of .500 hockey we will never get anywhere.
They are missing Gonchar & Alfie from last season.. and added Ryan & McArthur.. Should they not be better?
Or since the ‘stars’ are healthy and playing… did some of the other players just sort of relax… and not drive as hard?
Their defensive game was 2nd best to Chicago last season on goals against… It’s mindboggling that they could be so bad this season.. when they basically lost two older players..
You know what I’m almost afraid to admit it but it sort of smells like they want pmac out and thus are not putting the effort into. When you think about it, the only game everyone showed up in is against Detroit and that was alla about emotional retribution.
Apparently Emery’s girlfriend sent a twitter response to Lehner on his comments about Emery’s fight… he was right by the way…
I saw that and told The Lehnz to give her “the stare”. Had no idea that was Emery’s girl though. Her Twitter thumbnail I thought she was some washed up old E-Weekly hag or something, but she is actually pretty cute in full version.
Apparently Lehner tweeted back….
I know… so what?
completely agree with Gordon ramsli? and his comment below. While a trade would be good, we would likely lose right now, selling low, buying high. Better to promote from within right now, and give some hungry players a chance. Ceci, Claesson, Hoffman, stone, prince, pageau, puempel. Take your pick.
Let guys like greening, kassian, cowen, Phillips and so on watch from the box for a few games. See what hungry hard working players actually look like on the ice. yes there are a few others that could see the bench also. I’m not saying fire the GM or Coach. They can only tell the players what to do. If the players aren’t going to make smart decisions or skate hard every shift, the only thing a coach can do is bench you. It would be nice to start seeing that happen.
also, biggest problem, myself and probably most other fans have with this year. Of all the wins we have, we have only looked like a better/hungrier team once, against Detroit. Every other win OT loss and loss we have looked like the worse team by far. Usually the games were only close or won by a 1 man show, whether its the goalie in net, or spezza’s hat trick and so on. Only once have we played like a team(Detroit). Every other game has been a poor effort regardless of outcome.
Keep in mind, most of the teams we’ve beat have been considered bottom dwellers, and a few dwellers have beaten us. THAT’s why fans are not happy this year so far
20th overall in the league in pct(%) of capacity – http://espn.go.com/nhl/attendance/_/sort/homePct. sandwiched between the hockey hotbeds of Denver and Tampa Bay. *slow clap*. well fucking done Sens fans. No wonder our teams has a better away record.
If Melnyk’s message in cutting back on freebies was to publicly show the complacency of the fan base, it’s working. Otherwise, nothing has really changed from last season to this one.
Fans were complacent last year too. And every year before that. That’s the market.
Honestly, I’m a little tired of your “well done sens fans” posts. Its up to the organization to fill the arena, not the average person who can afford a couple of seats in the coke zero zone. I went to the SJS game. 3 tix plus convenience charges, plus some other fee, plus parking plus $16 for 2 cokes and a popcorn. Add to this the fact that it felt like boarding a fucking plane with pat downs and metal detector wands.
How can they do this? Ice a winner, dont allow your main identity in Alfie go (too late now). Make it a fun place to go to for more than just hockey, advertise ways to easily get there via shuttles or OC transpo and ditch the fucking security shakedown.
It is on the organization to sell tickets, not on the fans being guilted into buying. Bryden did that…how did that work out? Melnyk can play moneyball all he wants…fact is, the drop in interest from fans is palpable.
who is your favourite team going to be when the team skips town?
Thank god Tuesday nights are a decent tv night. The half-assed effort by the Sens made it easy to switch the channel for something worthwhile. It’s just amazing how this team has a very Jekyll and Hyde mentality. One moment you watch them play and see that they can dominate. The next, they look like they belong in the OHL (if that).
Paul Maclean really needs to embed a hard work ethic in their minds because right now they are playing with a complete lack of desire to win. It’s amazing that a completely depleted roster from last year, with a majority of AHL players called up to take the helm played with much more heart and success than a full roster this year. And don’t blame the Sens fans for empty seats. If the product on the ice isn’t worth watching because of a complete lack of effort, why would anyone want to waste their good money and time?
This team is broken and needs fixing badly…and quickly.
What I don’t get is how bad they are compared to last season. Yeah a lot of the stars were hurt.. but the bottom 6 guys on this team were great last season.
Pageau was really good in pre-season.. but he was overpowered with those big western teams…
Help on D.. other than Boro isn’t coming from Bingo.
Ceci still has to work on his defensive game… he would do no better, right now, than what they have — which is a nightmare…
Melnyk should have let Murray spend more $$ to get a decent d-man rather than go cheap with Corvo..
Hindsight is always good..but how good do Andre Benoit & Ben Bishop look right now..
And Melnyk can hold as tightly to his wallet as much as he wants. The empty seats at CTC are not going to help fill his pockets with the product he has on the ice. He needs to spend money to make money. Mediocrioty or a less than mediocre product on the ice isn’t going to sell tickets.
i think you are attributing too much of the defense failure to Melnyk not spending. Melnyk not wanting to spend is a factor now when the sens actually want to make a move on D, but BM was never in the market for a more established d-man this summer. The sens assessed their d-corps made up of Karlsson, Methot, Cowen, PW46, Chris Phillips and Gryba to be sufficient. Hence the contracts to PW46 and Cowen. They also factored in the fact that Borocop was available to fill in and will give the bottom pairing a run in camp. They added Corvo purely for the use as 7th D-man and they have shown that.
What they didnt expect is for Cowen especially to bomb the way he has. I think its made everything fall apart on the back because it forces Maclean to make pairings that dont work. PW46′s defensive issues were always there, so no real surprises there. Gryba – has taken a step back but still i would not say as bad as Cowen. Chris Phillips – i think his crappy performance is more a result of having increased minutes due to the other pairings not holding up. Otherwise, if Maclean is consciously playing Phillips more minutes, then something is really really wrong much deeper. Phillips is not 15 minute worthy anymore.
now were the sens wrong in assessing Cowen as top 4 D-man this summer and handing him the contract? what does his current state of play say about his holdout?
It’s not really Jekyll and Hyde cuz they’ve been bad since the beginning of the year.
I can’t see anything radically changing somehow in the last couple of months in terms of which players we see a future for and which ones we don’t. Does Cowen now have no future? Wiercioch? I think the best thing to do on D is to set the pairing for the future and let them work things out. Methot-Karlsson, Cowen-Wiercioch and then pair Phillips with Gryba. Send Borowiecki down to get some reps with Ceci.
Otherwise you’re looking at giving up on someone (waive Gryba? Trade Phillips a few months after Alfredsson moved on?). I don’t want to be sitting here a few years from now thinking “man too bad we traded ____ just because the entire team was playing like crap”.
Hax you cant think thatw way, you would never get a trade done, of course some of our players might become good elsewhere, its normal, everyteam has that happen. Doesnt eman they dont pull the trigger on a deal to better the team.
IF Cowen aint playing well now or in his last 100+ games then we need to find somebody who has.
Good prospect either show signs of improving (or anything) after 100 games, Cowen had not done so. He’s been seriously injured twice already with 2 major surgeries. If anything he has digressed.
Plain and simple. Ottawa’s poor start can be attributed to the defense. The three game winning streak can be attributed to Lehner being able to bail out the defensemen. Unfortunately, Anderson can’t do it game in and game out. The team should call Richardson and ask him to come to Ottawa for a few days and teach the players how to play a little bit of D.
Well the game I saw last night we lose the puck in their end, everyone clears the zone except one guy to half ass press them.
When we have the puck in our end they did not leave the zone and wait for us in theirs like we did, if was a full court press pushing us to make mistakes.
Our D may have sucked ass but the score was 5-0 and the zero is not a defensive issue other than getting the puck out.
We were owned for 200 feet last night,
Well I have been ok so far waiting on the team to come around, still am but wow last game was brutal to watch, past years we have had an influx of players coming up with something to prove, all in never quit attitude, don’t have it this year so far.
It is not Alfie, he is washed up and I have seen the team play worse than we are now with him on the team, you can golden boy him if you like.
MacArthur and or Ryan replace him hands down.
Losing Gonchar however even as slow as he was getting back could be a huge downgrade to our D, he could get the puck out.
The team is more complacent now and I think thats the problem.
A trade or two might just shake things up or call ups.
I’m sure most of you hockey fans have seen that PHI just beat PIT with a final score of 2-1. I didn’t watch the game so can’t really speak to how each team played. But, I think this probably speaks to PHI not being nearly as bad as their record reflects so far. OTT still played an embarrassing game last night. But, I don’t think saying we lost to one of the worse teams in the league is really representative of the product in PHI. I’m really interested to see how OTT comes out next game. When you lose like OTT did you usually have something to prove next game. I think their effort will be very telling, whether they win or lose.
At this point it’s not about effort…it’s about winning games…all the teams in our division are finding ways to get valuable points each game. I watched phi-pitts, and phil brought it to them. Emery made some awesome saves which we didn’t have yesterday by the so -called #1. Anyways, dont want to go into detail again about last game but one thing I think we cannot continue to hear is that “it’s just one game…” “let’s forget it and move on..” by the time we know it it’ll be game 81/82 and we will have said “it’s just one game ” too many times
I get that we desperately need points. Your comment sort of made me think of National Lampoon’s Christmas Vacation right after Clark W. Griswold’s outdoor light display fails. Daughter says – ” He worked really hard grandma”. Grandfather says in response “So do washing machines”.
I guess for me it’s still more about effort though. If they play one hell of a game and lose, i’m never really too sour about that. If they lose to Boston but play one hell of a game then that’s fine by me. On the flip side, most of their wins this year really aren’t anything to brag about. Even though the team has been horrendous at times, last night they came out totally flat. At this point I don’t really know if they have the pieces to get the job done on a nightly basis, but after last night’s performance, they better be ready to play on Friday.
Totally agree here…
Bench Cowen and see the miracle on ice before our eyes
Its much different game when playing your arch rivals. Those games are usually pretty close, PIT usually owns them but PHI always plays them tough.
When PHI came to OTT they were a mess, they got a big blowout game, I’m sure that pumped them up. Philly is shit and is still shit just cuz they win a few games doesnt make them respectable.
I don’t think the flyers are as bad as you do, but it’s not really the point.
When we start rationalizing losses, it’s time to admit that the Sens are a bad team right now.
I agree, on paper they are just ridiculous, especially at the forward position…
Here is to hoping they don’t start to click.
Vs the Bruins I wanna see:
Mac Spezza Zibanejad
Hoffman Turris Ryan
Conacher Smith Neil
Kassian Grant Condra
Press box: Greening, Michalek
Press box: Cowen
New post up here
Copyright © 2013- SensChirp.ca.
SensChirpBack to Top